Thursday, September 14, 2006

DiPietro Deal Not So Dippy?

OK, on first blush we at FAUXRUMORS were as astonished by the 15 year DiPietro deal as almost all others. We were told to expect a long term deal, as much as 10 years, but never in our wildest dreams did we see this coming. Like all others we also thought what is this guy (Wang) thinking? Is he nuts?
Well, he probably is based upon other moves and statements he's made over the years, but is this particular move really all that bad?
The key will be how well DiPietro plays. If he's merely a mediocre goalie over the next 3-5 years, then this deal will be considered a huge bust. However, even if that should occur there is an out for Wang.
That is, if he's willing to eat some of that money to buy some cap space. Hear us out here: Lets say DiPietro sucks toast in 4 years. Well, all Wang has to do is ship him off to the AHL to ride busses and the Isles are saved his 4.5 mil on the cap.(Wang still has to pay him)
If Ricky decides he doesn't want to ride the busses, or retire, then both the Isles and Wang are off the hook.
However, if DiPietro should finally develop into a top 5 goalie then this deal is a brilliant piece of work. Renegotiation is NOT allowed! Lets say that in 5 years Ricky is a Vezina trophy winner, he could very well be in the bottom half of salaries paid to goalies with no recourse to change this.
If after another 5 years DiPietro begins to wane, they still have the AHL option available. Therefore, this contract is only a gamble in as much as Wang is willing to eat the contract should it not work out.
Definitely not as 'Dippy' as many are making it out to be.

13 comments:

choch said...

So what happens if the cap goes down next year, or in 5 years, or in 10? What if DiPietro stays about the same as he is now: a dependable enough, if unspectacular starter. Tough. Wang can still demote DiPietro, but that means they have to replace him. What if they don't have anyone solid enough to take his place?
Here's something even wore: what if they develop another young goaltender who has the potential to be even better than DiPietro? The Islanders are now tied, through this contract, to have DiPietro as their starter for as long as he plays in the NHL. $4.5 million is too much to pay a backup. The Isles cannot afford to play any young goalies enough to properly develop them.

OverDaRainbow said...

FUX, I cannot say I agree with your slant here... Wang seems to be the type of egomaniac who feeds his needs by behaving outrageously just to get attention - negative or positive, it doesn't matter... Certainly, you have not forgotten about the Neil Smith fiasco, and consequently, the back-up goalie GM hire... Wang can't possibily be looking out for the best interests of the organization... I believe he sits down, thinks about the most ridiculous thing he could do in a given situation, and then DOES IT!!!! We've all seen Dipietro enough to know that a Vezina Trophy isn't coming ANY time soon...

fauxrumors said...

Same issue Choch. If they deem he isn't good enough to start or too expensive cap-wise to back up they will still have the demotion option. As stated in the original post it all will depend if Wang would be willing to 'eat' the contract? So far he has been unwilling to do that with Yashin

fauxrumors said...

Oh don't confuse our take here 'Rainbow as meaning we believe that Wang is sane.
He clearly isn't, but this contract isn't nearly as insane as some of his other moves that you outlined

Fla15 said...

I think this deal is a coach / GM killer. If DiPietro reaches his potential, he will basicly control the power and by default, run the team.

"I don't like the coach (or GM). It's him or me".

Well Rick since you are now untradeable thanks to your brilliant 15 year contract, it's bye bye coach /GM.

If I we're an NHL coach or GM looking for work I'd stay away from that organization. To bad, the Islanders are a proud franchise.

fauxrumors said...

Well, FLA, it may turn out to be a coach killer if Ricky doesn't play up to potential, but the GM is safe for now. The GM Is the owner, and the owner the GM! Snow is little more than a figure head, especially in regard to important matters

True Hockey Fan said...

Sorry buddy.. but your missing the finer points.

1. Sending a guy who makes $4.5 a year to the minors just to try and get him to retire isn't likely to happen until MAYBE his 13th or 14th season. If for example in 5 seasons he ends up blowing... do you think for a minute he would hate riding the buses so much that he decides to retire and give up the remaining 45 million dollars ? Sorry.. but you can kill a lot of time on a bus counting your money in your head.

2. He has a one way contract which means he gets NHL salary no matter where he plays, which also means the money gets counted against the cap UNLESS he is injured.
This is the exact problem that the Devils are having with a healthy Mogilny and Malhakov's $7.1 million combined working against this seasons cap.. even though there is very VERY little chance either of them will play for the Devils again.

So considering once again that the money will indeed be counted against the cap barring long term injury, do you still believe for a minute that Wang will demote him just to annoy him enough to want to quit and furthermore do you still believe that Rick will just give up the remainder of his salary?

fauxrumors said...

Incorrect 'Hockeyfan, if DiPietro is sent down and clears wavers( Unliley a team would try to get him even at 1/2 his salry commitment) his salary does NOT count agaonst the cap
Only players signed to multi year deals and over 35 are counted if sent down in the second and subsequent years of their deals

Anonymous said...

Your forgetting about the fact that there are provisions in both the CBA as well as the SPC which hold a teams ownership accountable for attempted circumvention of the contracts.

"(c) The Commissioner may take whatever steps he deems necessary to
investigate the circumstances under which a Player is placed, or remains, on the Non-
Roster List. If the Commissioner has reason to believe that Non-Roster status has not
been utilized properly by the involved Club, or that requests to designate a Player as Non-
Roster are or were in any way improper, or if he determines that the Club has used the
Non-Roster List to evade the Active Roster limit or otherwise Circumvent any provision
of this Agreement, he may take such disciplinary action against the Club as he deems
appropriate."

This is from the CBA regarding non-roster players. That is exactly what DP would be in the case of him not being with the NHL team. Regardless of whether or not he clears standard waivers and return waivers he still becomes a non-roster player and would be subject to the scrutiny of the league commish. As we all know the NHL front office was not happy about this deal in the first place, so it's likely that anything that even appears to be shady would be investigated.

Then there is the language in the CBA regarding NHL/NHLPA grievances. The SPC provides language that a player cannot be demoted without just cause, this is outside of the language that defines injured players as well as conditioning stints. A team that demotes a player without just cause actually has to ASK that player for permission. Barring DP's permission the clubs option at that point would be to suspend him and face the grievance and subsequent arbitrators ruling.
This is unlikely to happen because unlike an arbitrators decision during a hearing regarding the amount to be paid which takes into account comperable play and existing contracts. The club would have to prove that DP isn't playing at a level which befits an NHL goaltender, he would NOT have to be playing up to the level of another goaltender earning his salary range, but just be performing as well no worse than 3rd within the Islanders roster ( which would is not a likely scenario as they are unlikely to sign anyone much better than him in the future due their both their unwillingness to sign a comperable talent and his comperable salary, and for the reason that it's likely that no legitimate starting goalie would likely want to come to a team where he has virtually no shot of taking over the starters position)
As long as DP plays as well as any backup goalie in the league it's a 95% chance that the arbitrator will rule that the demotion is a circumvention of the SPC and therefore give the NHL a valid reason to enforce sanctions against the parent club.
This could be as simple as not allowing him to be demoted, allowing the demotion with the cap hit or fines which would be heavier than the cap hit would be.
In any case, no legitimate businessman truly ever turns his back on the agency or regulatory body which governs all aspects of his business.

The circumvention clause in the CBA was written for exactly such as dealing as this contract. A friend of mine at the NHLPA told me that legal has been pouring over this contract because they know it will be challenged in the future. The common belief within the league is that it's intended purpose was to circumvent the contract and that neither side believes that he will indeed play for 15 years. This is akin to players taking payments after they retire, "restructuring" the pay. But as this is no longer a possibility due to the language of the CBA, this loophole exists until either the following CBA is negotiated or when this particular contract comes into question. Which ever will come first.

Nothing can be done about it until such a time as the Islanders make a move like sending him to the minors.
Then the chips shall fall, and it will be just another in a long line of Islanders "mishaps".

Anonymous said...

Your forgetting about the fact that there are provisions in both the CBA as well as the SPC which hold a teams ownership accountable for attempted circumvention of the contracts.

"(c) The Commissioner may take whatever steps he deems necessary to
investigate the circumstances under which a Player is placed, or remains, on the Non-
Roster List. If the Commissioner has reason to believe that Non-Roster status has not
been utilized properly by the involved Club, or that requests to designate a Player as Non-
Roster are or were in any way improper, or if he determines that the Club has used the
Non-Roster List to evade the Active Roster limit or otherwise Circumvent any provision
of this Agreement, he may take such disciplinary action against the Club as he deems
appropriate."

This is from the CBA regarding non-roster players. That is exactly what DP would be in the case of him not being with the NHL team. Regardless of whether or not he clears standard waivers and return waivers he still becomes a non-roster player and would be subject to the scrutiny of the league commish. As we all know the NHL front office was not happy about this deal in the first place, so it's likely that anything that even appears to be shady would be investigated.

Then there is the language in the CBA regarding NHL/NHLPA grievances. The SPC provides language that a player cannot be demoted without just cause, this is outside of the language that defines injured players as well as conditioning stints. A team that demotes a player without just cause actually has to ASK that player for permission. Barring DP's permission the clubs option at that point would be to suspend him and face the grievance and subsequent arbitrators ruling.
This is unlikely to happen because unlike an arbitrators decision during a hearing regarding the amount to be paid which takes into account comperable play and existing contracts. The club would have to prove that DP isn't playing at a level which befits an NHL goaltender, he would NOT have to be playing up to the level of another goaltender earning his salary range, but just be performing as well no worse than 3rd within the Islanders roster ( which would is not a likely scenario as they are unlikely to sign anyone much better than him in the future due their both their unwillingness to sign a comperable talent and his comperable salary, and for the reason that it's likely that no legitimate starting goalie would likely want to come to a team where he has virtually no shot of taking over the starters position)
As long as DP plays as well as any backup goalie in the league it's a 95% chance that the arbitrator will rule that the demotion is a circumvention of the SPC and therefore give the NHL a valid reason to enforce sanctions against the parent club.
This could be as simple as not allowing him to be demoted, allowing the demotion with the cap hit or fines which would be heavier than the cap hit would be.
In any case, no legitimate businessman truly ever turns his back on the agency or regulatory body which governs all aspects of his business.

The circumvention clause in the CBA was written for exactly such as dealing as this contract. A friend of mine at the NHLPA told me that legal has been pouring over this contract because they know it will be challenged in the future. The common belief within the league is that it's intended purpose was to circumvent the contract and that neither side believes that he will indeed play for 15 years. This is akin to players taking payments after they retire, "restructuring" the pay. But as this is no longer a possibility due to the language of the CBA, this loophole exists until either the following CBA is negotiated or when this particular contract comes into question. Which ever will come first.

Nothing can be done about it until such a time as the Islanders make a move like sending him to the minors.
Then the chips shall fall, and it will be just another in a long line of Islanders "mishaps".

Anonymous said...

Your forgetting about the fact that there are provisions in both the CBA as well as the SPC which hold a teams ownership accountable for attempted circumvention of the contracts.

"(c) The Commissioner may take whatever steps he deems necessary to
investigate the circumstances under which a Player is placed, or remains, on the Non-
Roster List. If the Commissioner has reason to believe that Non-Roster status has not
been utilized properly by the involved Club, or that requests to designate a Player as Non-
Roster are or were in any way improper, or if he determines that the Club has used the
Non-Roster List to evade the Active Roster limit or otherwise Circumvent any provision
of this Agreement, he may take such disciplinary action against the Club as he deems
appropriate."

This is from the CBA regarding non-roster players. That is exactly what DP would be in the case of him not being with the NHL team. Regardless of whether or not he clears standard waivers and return waivers he still becomes a non-roster player and would be subject to the scrutiny of the league commish. As we all know the NHL front office was not happy about this deal in the first place, so it's likely that anything that even appears to be shady would be investigated.

Then there is the language in the CBA regarding NHL/NHLPA grievances. The SPC provides language that a player cannot be demoted without just cause, this is outside of the language that defines injured players as well as conditioning stints. A team that demotes a player without just cause actually has to ASK that player for permission. Barring DP's permission the clubs option at that point would be to suspend him and face the grievance and subsequent arbitrators ruling.
This is unlikely to happen because unlike an arbitrators decision during a hearing regarding the amount to be paid which takes into account comperable play and existing contracts. The club would have to prove that DP isn't playing at a level which befits an NHL goaltender, he would NOT have to be playing up to the level of another goaltender earning his salary range, but just be performing as well no worse than 3rd within the Islanders roster ( which would is not a likely scenario as they are unlikely to sign anyone much better than him in the future due their both their unwillingness to sign a comperable talent and his comperable salary, and for the reason that it's likely that no legitimate starting goalie would likely want to come to a team where he has virtually no shot of taking over the starters position)
As long as DP plays as well as any backup goalie in the league it's a 95% chance that the arbitrator will rule that the demotion is a circumvention of the SPC and therefore give the NHL a valid reason to enforce sanctions against the parent club.
This could be as simple as not allowing him to be demoted, allowing the demotion with the cap hit or fines which would be heavier than the cap hit would be.
In any case, no legitimate businessman truly ever turns his back on the agency or regulatory body which governs all aspects of his business.

The circumvention clause in the CBA was written for exactly such as dealing as this contract. A friend of mine at the NHLPA told me that legal has been pouring over this contract because they know it will be challenged in the future. The common belief within the league is that it's intended purpose was to circumvent the contract and that neither side believes that he will indeed play for 15 years. This is akin to players taking payments after they retire, "restructuring" the pay. But as this is no longer a possibility due to the language of the CBA, this loophole exists until either the following CBA is negotiated or when this particular contract comes into question. Which ever will come first.

Nothing can be done about it until such a time as the Islanders make a move like sending him to the minors.
Then the chips shall fall, and it will be just another in a long line of Islanders "mishaps".

fauxrumors said...

Interestig that our site doesn't allow 'Anonymous' postings, yet some how this one was printed in triplicate.
We have a theory how/why this occured, but rest assured our people are on the case and will expose why.

True Hockey Fan said...

Hmmm no anonymous comments, three posts with exactly the same text but posted over a period of 6 hours.

Who has the ability to cover their tracks? A White-Hat Hacker? The CIA?
The NSA? Gary Bettmans office?
Hmmm no.. they wouldn't repeat themselves.. this is more on the line of Brainwashing...

I figured it out...

It's Karl Rove!!!!!!